This expat locals dating thing

[rubber ducky]

How do we define culture? There are asians with western culture, westerners with asian culture, asians with african culture, africans with asian cultures, arabs with western culture, westerners with arab culture. Is there even really a western culture? do europeans have the same culture as americans? do w.europeans have the same culture as e.europeans?  

[Burbage]

The Western culture has been shaped by hundreds of years of Christianity. This means that most western societies share a large number of common cultural threads, although, of course, there are parts of each culture that are unique and parts which are shared with only a few countries. Still, the basic culture is similar in all european derived countries.

Chinese culture is presumably shaped by taoism/buddhism, Japanese culture by shintoism , indian culture is shaped by hinduism, Malaysian culture by islam. Put on top of this the political shaping of each culture (Maoism springs to mind) then the vast difference between western culture and chinese culture is not that hard to understand.

It is one thing, of course, to apprciate and either like or dislike a culture from an objective viewpoint. It is completely another to be completely immersed in a new culture through association with a lover, girlfriend or wife.

Does that make any sense?

[rubber ducky]

Well, not really, because what is basic European culture? In lots of European countries, there is strong Muslim and Pagan influences, as well as Jewish influence. I don't see how the assumption that just because one is white or western means they neccessarily have white culture. i know lots of white people who identify more with buddhism and hinduism than with Christianity. I just hate it when the word culture is used and assumes all white people identify with each other in the same way that a person has "Asian culture" or "Middle Eastern culture" or "African culture" and therefore adheres to one set of princicples. what exactly is unique to european culture? how does having Christian values as a basis for society make certain elements unique? I have yet to find any one thing in "western culture" that does not exist elsewhere in the world. And say even if you were to find someone down the street who would most likely have the same "culture"...how would you be able to attribute any differences you have to either    individual differences or cultural differences? People say it's Asian "culture"/Confucian values to take care of their parents in old age. Does that mean Europeans don't take care of their old folks? Of course not, i know lots of white people who take care of their grandparents, live under the same roof. i know lots of asians who don't. so what is culture? So if you were european and grew up in asia then what? if you were asian and grew up in europe, then what?

[Burbage]

Rubber Ducky,

Did I mention race? Race has got nothing to do with it. I'm talking about all people from whatever culture irrespective of race. I think you should re-examine your stance on that one.

You are, of course, perfectly right. There are thousands of secondary influences on the development of any particular culture. I was talking general rather than specific. Unfortunately there isn't enough space to go into them all here!

I was merely pointing out the major influences.

[bluemousemonkey]

kes - listen to what you say.
My god - if there's anyone on this board who has 'whole self' or 'psychic' energy, it's you!
I'm serious.
Doesn't matter WHAT your obstacles, you have such a strong drive to be unique.
You will ALWAYS be a discovery - it's a pity that others are so few to appreciate your depths. I don't care how cynical people are about 'depth', it's obvious to me that you "got your own" ( go listen to Nina Simone singing "God Bless The Child That's Got His Own')- there are not so many available to recognise you - but for goodness sake, you should not be made less, by the very average stature of others!

[rubber ducky]

Kes, why don't you take the lead and call instead? don't let yourself be subjugatd into the role of a "female." You can stop the games if you want to right?

[T2K]

Going back to an earlier point, it's all about culture to many people.
 
I'm definitely attracted to people who share the same culture as myself, generally defined as "Western".  It's just a personal preference.  Often this is seen as a race thing, and to be honest it often is since most Westerners are cauacasian.

However, I've dated girls here ("locals" and otherwise) that were of Asian ethnicity but to whom I could easily relate and be happy with since they had cultural outlooks and experiences similar to mine.

I've also had the interesting and somewhat unpleasant reverse experience of meeting caucasian girls with cultural backgrounds and goals more similar to the stereotypical SPG or girls from poor Asian nations looking for an economic lifeline.  I say unpleasant because I made the false assumption that they were "like me" because they looked the same, but I was very mistaken.  Lesson learned, you can't always judge a book by its cover.

At the end of the day, in Singapore, there are a lot more single "western" men than there are females.  That's a fact.  I mean my god, look around on a Friday night at any of the typical "expat" hangouts - it's depressing.  I decided to focus mostly on the alcohol sometime in mid '99 or so and just hope for the best.  Sometimes things work out well, and if they don't at least I don't remember much.

You can compromise and change your goals or you can just accept that the nature of the game is different here than it was "back home".

[kes]

I agree it's all about culture.  It's through culture that one can relate to another.  Like I mentioned before no one can relate to another 100%.

bluemousemonkey,
Thank-you for your words.  I'm so sorry that I have to delete my previous posts mainly because at times I write things that don't make much sense.  Dating is a frustrating thing.  I just usually like to hang out with people.  

But like my previous posts, especially in the SPG posts, people know that for me I'm really in a no win situation here in Singapore.  Experience has taught me that.  I'm seen as a 'novelty' by the locals, and novelties, in time wear off.

Singapore is the only country I know where I feel conscious about what I am.  Partly because the people made sure that I do.  Also partly my fault for feeling it.

Local guys find me a 'novelty' and at the end of the day, they are not comfortable with me because I'm not like them.  I don't share the same values, we're not on the same wavelength, I'm too opinionated, too educated ... the list goes on.  I will be labelled a 'SPG' if I'm seen with a white guy, even with a friend, (sorry I'm not a very PC person), but they can go pee in their pants for all I care for labelling me.  So here in itself is a major cultural difference.  

I have no problems relating to local girls.  I suppose in general girls everywhere in the world can relate to one another.  It's a girl thing.  

I make no secret that I miss my life back in the US and the simplicity of it, but that's over with.

[This message has been edited by kes (edited 16-02-2002).]

[This message has been edited by kes (edited 17-02-2002).]

[kylie]

Where do thee beautiful expat people go out?

[Burbage]

Kylie,

I can't speak for the beautiful ones, but I'm often seen around Emerald Hill (No. 5, Que Pasa) and sometimes in Muddy Murphys next to Orchard Towers.

[carolklc]

hi Burbage, can you explain to me , why are so many people hanging out in No. 5? If my memory serves me right, that is the club opposite the Esmerada at Peranakan place. I have bypassed it several times, but it is always so packed.

[Burbage]

Why is No. 5 popular?

1. Doesn't serve draught Tiger, has Carlsberg instead.

2. Has a pretty good happy hour, drinks 1/2 price from 6-9.

3. People looking for karaoke are told to piss off

4. Music is all western.

5. It's like pubs back home, and there are only a few of those in Singapore.

6. If it's really packed, Ice Cold Beer is two steps away.

7. Service is above average for Singapore, though still not very good.

8. Close to Orchard, cuppage etc.

[kes]

Yup.  NO5 reminds me of Saint Jacks back in Philly!

[Notasmiserablechick]

Sorry guys to cut in so late...but would love to take Burbage up on his offer to meet some of his male friends! ( being brave here and biting the bullet) I had loads of male buddies back in the UK and really miss our evenings out having a good old chat over a few beers!

Burbage....if you would be so kind as to introduce me it would be gratefully appreciated!  

[Xenjya]

Notasmiserable chick!!! here is my 2 bobs worth....
I can vouch for Burbage's friends, they are a great crowd of interesting men and women.
His mates  almost make up a full cricket team  at number 5 on a Friday night .  And yes!!! it is a lot like the pubs back home. The service is a dam sight better than most in Singapore, the waiters all remmebr what u drink, the owner interacts with his patrons and the music is fab, the drinks 1/2 price and the MEN!!! ripe for the picking nealry every night of the week....