So How

[antoine]

I have followed this board daily for the past 6 months, and have learnt many things from both the board manager, and the members.

I have some questions, about a situation in which I am involved.

BACKGROUND
I have been in Singapore since August,2000 when I came here to marry a Singaporean, female who I had met before.

We were married in November 2000, in Singapore.
Between that time and now (February 2001),I have  been "living", (first alone)and now with my wife here.

I am a university graduate, and worked as a computer consultant in my country, before coming here.

I have not worked here, but am actively seeking employment.

My wife is NUS graduate and a trained secondary school teacher, with about 5 years govt. school teaching experience...who left that employment and worked in private company for 4 years...now she is working in  a madrassah, (muslim school) as a teacher for about a year,by choice and earns S$1,500.00 monthly.
I have already applied(with all documents) for a long term visit pass and was only extended to two weeks.

THE SITUATION
Every two weeks my Visitors Pass is extended by SIR so far.

I have been here approx. five months extending my pass every two weeks.

On my last visit today, I was told to obtain a ticket for a departure date for two weeks hence, and return, and my Pass will be extended...they never said "extended to that time", ie two weeks, but I suspect it...and I also suspect that when I get this ticket and return, SIR will ask me to leave the country at the end of the extended two week period.

The Questions.
1. Given the above, can anyone assist with the following?

2. Should I apply for a PR on the basis of my marriage alone.
If I am employed (and work in Singapore), will/can that affect granting of a PR status.

3.Should I apply for an EP, then PR.?
4. How long can a EP application take?
5. How long can a PR application take?

3.Is it fairly easy(low beaureaucracy and low/no cash requirement ie.) to set up a consultancy here?

4. Can I start up a company, while the PR is being processed?

5. Can I Work for a company while the PR is being processed.

6. Should I request an interview with SIR, on these matters.

7. In anyone's experience, are they receptive to interview requests, and do they listen, to you?

8. Should I request assistance from our MP?(I have been so advised).

9. Can a MP really offer any assistance in this regard.

10. Does race or religion (covertly) have anything to do with the granting of these passes/status?

11. Is it necessary to get a lawyer for this.?

All my informants from a wide cross-section of the S'pore population seem to want me o believe that...Ques. 10 factors a great deal.

I have not accepted this yet...
I really think this board can help...
Sorry for the long post, I am not sure if I have asked all the questions...normally one does not see as clearly when one is involved in a situation...

I am asking those you who have experience in this to please  share it with me, so I can make informed decisions...

Thankyou

[This message has been edited by antoine (edited 05-02-2001).]

[This message has been edited by antoine (edited 07-02-2001).]

[Brit]

Haven't got a clue about your worry about the "race/religion" aspect but I understand the govt. is apparently fair in these matters. Probably your wife's salary may be a factor.

Why don't you ask her to phone her Member of Parliament for the constituency she lives in and ask him/her to help? It will probably give a positive outcome.

[cs]

That is a lot of questions. For some of them you might want to refer to the archives. I will answer those which I have answers handy.

You can apply for PR. It is however unlikely that it will be granted based on your wife's income alone. For the PR to be granted, it would be best if you find work and get an EP. Your employer will help you apply and you will most likely be given a temp pass to stay in Singapore. As a rough guide, you should have very little trouble getting your PR if your combined salary is more than S$5,000 per month. Another critical consideration is your education. This is scrutinised very carefully as there have been instances of people who submitted fake qualifications or qualifications brought from a dip/degree mill. Finally you should also of course have no criminal record and not have been deported from any country.

On setting up a small company or consultancy, there is a PR category for foreign investors. However before granting the PR, SIR will closely examine the proposed company. From the SIR site, what they are looking for are sufficent captial and a track record. You will also have to make a deposit of S$1.5 million.

When you apply for an EP, you can  simultaneously apply for PR. On average, it will take 6 months to 1 year to get your PR. If you are rejected, you should write in and appeal. This is because SIR needs to write to the parties that issued your documents to verify them. If the counter party does not respond, the application would then be rejected. By appealing, you keep your case open and give the counter parties more time to respond.

With regard to getting help from your MP, there is very little that your MP can do aside from writing a polite letter to appeal your case. If you go to your MP's Meet the People sessions, you will find that PR petitions are the most common reason for why people show up. To allow SIR to do a fair job, SIR is insulated from political pressue. Ditto for getting a lawyer who will write a letter and then bill you. Unlike countries like the US, Singapore has a very simple Immigration Act with no known legal loopholes to exploit.

On race and religion, I do not believe 10) to be true. Given that you have family roots in Singapore, you belong to what other countries commonly refer to as a non-quota category of immigrant. If you think about it, how can there be a secret Singapore government directive which says that that the government will break up familes of a certain ethnic group while preserving familes of another ethnic group?

Finally after having gone through the process of getting PR for my wife, a human tragedy which I saw very often was familes down at SIR with babies in tow. It was very obvious that the babies were brought along and paraded in an attempt to win compassion get their pass. I am not sure how the rules apply to you since your wife is a Singaporean. For instances where the wife is a non-Singaporean, she would normally be asked to leave Singapore upon detection of the pregnancy. This is to prevent the child from being born in Singapore and claiming rights of citizenship. Cruel as it may sound, this is in response of people who have abused the system and had children just to get their pass.    

[antoine]

Thanks to Brit and CS
I will leave the status quo in the state that I saw it..
I have worked elsewhere, and am privy to and have had experiences of "unspoken of, widely negatived, but firm governmental policies..."in some surprising places...

For the most part I adopt safe a "I-hear,-cannot-repeat,-not-sure-if-it-is-true-policy"
and speak on behalf of no govt...
but in my experiences...I have learnt that benficiaries of any divide, most always deny it...and those who are alienated by it, strongly affirm it, mostly...there is however always some truth in generalizations-even this one...
nevertheless (like you all)I hope to maintain my "non-acceptance" of 'factor 10'...too much said.

My academic references can be checked
I have no criminal record
I have never been deported from any country.
...and work/career path can be referenced as well. So that part is OK

I still have one overiding question
I am assuming that I continue to "top-up" my visitor's pass every two weeks at SIR...while the PR/EP are being processed...if I do not get a job in S'pore
during that time.

Am I correct in this?

Now this is a real concern...
I have a big passport...and it can hold six of SIR's extension stamps easily.

At that rate of return(to SIR)and their SIR's method of placing  ONLY two stamps on each page...I have already exhausted 20 percent of my recently issued passport(valid for 10 years).
I could need a new passport in three months!!!
However if I depart as is the convention in these cases, my ten year passport, which I expect to last three to five years of travel, may just last six months...but I should be happy, cos I am staying in S'pore.

Anybody has this problem....

[This message has been edited by antoine (edited 05-02-2001).]

[This message has been edited by antoine (edited 05-02-2001).]

[Z MunchKin]

Hello there,
 I read your post and I reckon I am going to have the same problem when my boyfriend actually converts and live s here.i am thinking about the possible job opportunities he could have now bu unfortunately,it 's really negative replies tat i have been getting.
 I would really love to know about ur situation more and if u dont mind can u email me and we could discuss more then.My email address is:
shotbycupid@gohip.com

thanks and best woshes

[James JPN]

Most embassy's will add pages at no cost to you.

Hope this helps.

[Rob]

British High Comm won't. If you fill up yr passport, you have to get a new one

[Teddy]

About your questions on starting up a company, I have been told by PriceWaterhouse Coopers that as a foreigner you can open a Pte Ltd in S'pore which requires (at least) one local partner plus S$100,000. I did plan to be self-employed in the IT industry in S'pore like I am over here in Germany, but I don't really fancy spending a 100K now but rather look for good job opportunities for the time being. I can always start up a company after a few years if I'll still fancy it then.
Anyway, if you do have the means and the will to start up a company, you don't necessarily have to make that S$1,5 million "foreign investment" (which would most likely grant you PR) but you could share 100K with a partner and open a Pte Ltd.
There's another way to start up which is called "sole property ship" (if I recall right) but that holds some problems like having very low chance of getting an EP or PR through this.
Wishing you and your spouse best of luck.
I'll continue working on my resume now.

[antoine]

Thank you CS and Teddy

Now I am a little confused...
CS said
"On setting up a small company or consultancy, there is a PR category for foreign investors. However before granting the PR, SIR will closely examine the proposed company. From the SIR site, what they are looking for are sufficent captial and a track record. You will also have to make a deposit of S$1.5 million. "

and Teddy says:
"About your questions on starting up a company, I have been told by PriceWaterhouse Coopers that as a foreigner you can open a Pte Ltd in S'pore which requires (at least) one local partner plus S$100,000"

Is there anymore information I can get on the following:
"There's another way to start up which is called "sole property ship" (if I recall right) but that holds some problems like having very low chance of getting an EP or PR through this."

I did also hear that it costs only $100.00 to set up a company in S'pore...
but there see to be some zeros missing...or too many present.
What type of company is this.

To Teddy all the best on your resume...
and thanks for your regards re: my marriage.

antoine

[This message has been edited by antoine (edited 07-02-2001).]

[cs]

The information that I posted is from the SIR web site. You can perhaps refer to it at
http://www.gov.sg/mha/sir/pr_sc/pr_app.html

With regard to setting up a company, there is nothing to stop you from putting up S$100,000 and joining a partnership. You can then apply for an appropriate pass. Depending on the nature of the business and your work arrangements, some passes which come to mind are EP, Social Visit(Business Visit) or Social Visit (Technopreneur). SIR will look at the application on a case by case basis and decide whether to grant the pass. As mentioned by Teddy, the probability of the pass being granted if you incorporate a small company or sole propritorship is probably non-existent. Looking at it from SIR's point of view, it would obviously be a serious loophole if anyone can come in to Singapore, set up a S$100 company and qualify for a long term pass.

With regard to the scheme I mentioned, the key point is that would qualify you straightaway for PR regardless of education, income or family roots. If the company is a bona fide undertaking, SIR would probably also give you a temp pass pending the granting of PR so that you can stay in Singapore and set up your company.  

[antoine]

Thanks again...you have provided a good source of information in the SIR website on PR...
I have seen the actual referenced information...but I still have not seen a site which mentions the '"sole property ship" (if I recall right)'or sole proprietership ...mentioned...

Please note I am not setting up a company on the pretext of obtaining a pass as reflected in "it would obviously be a serious loophole if anyone can come in to Singapore, set up a S$100 company and qualify for a long term pass."

On the contrary my intention is genuine and is really intended to provide me with a living wage to support my family and add to the products and services which assist in the development of the country I may live in.

Establishment and getting to market is (believe me) much shorter than applying for and getting a job...

And...as advanced and hi-tech as S'pore is...there are still many simple viable business ideas, which go un-developed...which do not require the capital outlay mentioned...

The ideas and setup/management/marketing skills I have...the capital I do not have...

Even though Internet and Virtuality is the rage, "brick and mortar" still supports the world...cobwebs cannot exist in mid-air(yet)
they are normally supported by well founded structures...(hope the anology is not missed)

Perhaps(I am now thinking) I need to see the requirements for Singaporeans, and ask my wife or a family member establish the operation, and I run it....Is that a viable option.

Thanks again

[This message has been edited by antoine (edited 07-02-2001).]

[try this]

Hi antoine,
Why don't you try calling up Contact Singapore to see if they can help? It's a branch of the Ministry of Manpower that provides information for foreigners working/studying in S'p or who are thinking of coming here. Tel: 332 8498 or Fax: 334 5312. E-mail: contact@spore.org.sg.

[Junebug]

Hi Antoine,

S$ 100 is the amount you legally need to set up a company, though it is in your own interest to set up the company with a higher amount. Like in most countries, the more money you invest the easier it will be.

It is easiest to open a company by going through a lawyer. We asked a lawyer to set up the company in legal terms as well as getting my employment pass.

We decided in June to open the company and had all the legal work done by mid July. I moved here end of September 2000 and had my employment pass set up middle of October. It really was fairly easy if you are willing to invest some money into a lawyer.

Good Luck!