Non-White Westerners

[Researcher]

So what is the social perception of non-white Americans in Singapore, particularly those of Asian descent? I notice a lot of comments about how Americans/Westerners are treated/viewed slightly differently, but I often wonder whether that's the case for those of us who don't happen to be white (me being one of them).

Being of Asian descent, do we just get lumped up along with everyone else who looks Asian, yet are an oddity because we don't speak anything but English, and with a Western accent too?

Just curious.

[Old Mike]

I have a Chinese American colleague. When he first arrived in Singapore he hailed a cab, and, in pure Mandarin, told the driver where he wanted to go. The driver insisted on seeing his money before he started, saying that as my colleague was clearly not Singaporean he wanted to be sure that he could pay the fare.
Thereafter my colleague spoke only Texan to cabbies, and had no further trouble.

[Researcher]

Haha... so what you're implying is, it still pays to play the Westerner card, even if you have an Asian face.

I'm sure the Singaporeans must be used to Westerners with Asian features by now, huh?

I know that in the Philippines, Filipino-Americans get the good and the bad - meaning, locals treat them well because they think it will get them more money, and also try to cheat them when possible, assuming they have money.

[orbiterdicta]

I know of an ABC (1st generation American) from SF who on arrival in Singapore had the shittiest, most conceited attitude towards our locals just because he had an American accent and a Beijing accent at the same time, saying our local women are stupid, me being the only exception just because he was interested in me. The perception I have is that back home they feel they are second grade and when they come here, they push their weight around. So tell me if I have observed wrong. However, an OC ABC (non-first generation American) agreed about what I said and he wouldn't want to even date an ABC lady. He was the one who at least made me know classier ABCs exist.

glossary for the uninitiated:
ABC = American Born Chinese
SF = San Francisco
OC = Orange County

[Researcher]

I know of an ABC (1st generation American) from SF who on arrival in Singapore had the shittiest, most conceited attitude towards our locals just because he had an American accent and a Beijing accent at the same time, saying our local women are stupid, me being the only exception just because he was interested in me. The perception I have is that back home they feel they are second grade and when they come here, they push their weight around. So tell me if I have observed wrong. However, an OC ABC (non-first generation American) agreed about what I said and he wouldn't want to even date an ABC lady. He was the one who at least made me know classier ABCs exist.

glossary for the uninitiated:
ABC = American Born Chinese
SF = San Francisco
OC = Orange County

What you say is quite possible, though it certainly depends from person to person. It sounds like your first acquaintance there (the one who was interested in you), is a bit of a jerk, if you don't mind my saying (haha). He sounds very full of himself and personally, I wouldn't like being around someone like that.

That aside, I do think that there may be something to people in general thinking they come from a "superior civilization" and acting like it in other countries abroad. In my opinion, people like that don't belong as expats and don't learn anything from their travel experiences. I certainly don't plan on coming to a foreign country and expecting them to adapt to me. I wouldn't learn anything that way.

[chitown]

So what is the social perception of non-white Americans in Singapore, particularly those of Asian descent? I notice a lot of comments about how Americans/Westerners are treated/viewed slightly differently, but I often wonder whether that's the case for those of us who don't happen to be white (me being one of them).

I'm curious to know people's thoughts about the perception of African Americans here in Singapore.  Do we get lumped in to the same social grouping as Americans or Africans?  Somehow, I don't get the sense that the social perceptions are the same as those of Caucasian Americans/Westeners.

[missleslie]

We cannot negate the fact that many (not all) Asians (not just Singaporeans or Filipinos) do give special 'treatment' to westerners (especially white ones) because, 1st, they are tall and good-looking (I sense someone is smiling BIG upon reading this), 2nd, still perceive them as visitors in the region which would mean 'money'.

But as asian-looking westerner or African-American, it is possible that only the 2nd applies since you don't look much different to the common-people in the region. 

Yes, you may want to emphasize your accent more often so you would be noticed and be treated nicely, but think again because they may abuse/cheat you in a way.

Sometimes it is ok to experience how to be treated negatively to understand the other face-of-life.  Just be wise enough when and when-not to use your so-called 'advantages'. 

[thornbirds]

I wouldn't call myself a westerner though I grew up in Oz. I was born in an Asian country before my parents migrated there. I’ve lived and worked in Singapore for more than 8 years now, and I don't speak any mandarin.

I am quite taken aback with people saying you'd get cheated by the locals. Singapore isn't the same as many other backward asian countries. Personally, except for some social differences, I find Singaporean in general are quite honest. However, I do find some social behaviors which appear to be rude and crude. There are also times when I detected resentments when they think I simply just refused to answer them in their language (which for some reasons they simply can’t accept that someone with Chinese features can’t speak mandarin – that can be quite frustrating). They'd decided that I must be one of those locals who stayed overseas for a couple of years and somehow stuck with this permanent fake western accent (This was told to me by a Singaporean friend of mine).

Other than that, I love living here. It’s clean, safe and you don’t need to be able to speak or read Chinese to get around.

[liberty]

well....basically....

I've stayed in oz for ten years... n came back with a strong natural australian accent.  I haven't noticed if people have treated me badly.  In fact, they treated me nicer & were more forgiving, sensing that i was not familiar with the local practices...

As for why white americans and chinese americans r treated differently? these r my thoughts.
westerners face = tourists = here to spend money
chinese face = locals = here to snatch bread n butter

I travel broadly, n everyone is nice to me whenever i tell them i'm on a short working pass/hoilday visit, this includes singapore.
All turned nasty and 'out to cheat me' when i told them I've MIGRATED here!
ha ha ha.....

now, u get the idea?

[wildberry16]

I wouldn't call myself a westerner though I grew up in Oz. I was born in an Asian country before my parents migrated there. I’ve lived and worked in Singapore for more than 8 years now, and I don't speak any mandarin.

I am quite taken aback with people saying you'd get cheated by the locals. Singapore isn't the same as many other backward asian countries. Personally, except for some social differences, I find Singaporean in general are quite honest. However, I do find some social behaviors which appear to be rude and crude. There are also times when I detected resentments when they think I simply just refused to answer them in their language (which for some reasons they simply can’t accept that someone with Chinese features can’t speak mandarin – that can be quite frustrating). They'd decided that I must be one of those locals who stayed overseas for a couple of years and somehow stuck with this permanent fake western accent (This was told to me by a Singaporean friend of mine).

Other than that, I love living here. It’s clean, safe and you don’t need to be able to speak or read Chinese to get around.

How come do you get the idea that all Singapore Chinese speak Mandarin?

Singapore has a large variety of Chinese people: some speak only English, some speak Mandarin, some speak Malay, and some (older folks) can only speak in their own dialect.

In my office, one Chinese doesn't speak Mandarin at all, though he is born in Singapore (he is a Peranakan, and went to school at a time when learning Mandarin was not compulsory for Chinese).

A few other colleagues are not familiar with Mandarin at all and would rather answer in English even if addressed in Mandarin.

[thaiguy]

Just look at the rental ads online or in the papers.  They mention races that they won't rent to. Unbelieveable... it is 2008 and we are living in a first world country.

[Señora Sensible]

I think so.
Non-white westerners do get treated differently to white westerners.  Well I only have 2 examples, 2 friends.  One living here and one visiting but both have commented on this.

[geodome]

Just look at the rental ads online or in the papers.  They mention races that they won't rent to. Unbelieveable... it is 2008 and we are living in a first world country.

I concur with you totally. Racism must be regulated, even if it is somewhat a national past time.

[jenbipp]

As an ABC, I enjoy going to Singapore to visit my parents. But I get a lot of crap from some of the locals in Singapore and from some of the HK tourists (I can't really differentiate between the two most of the time). They would talk to me in condescending tones or totally ignore me, although this usually happens when I speak Mandarin to them. After a while I just stopped using Mandarin when I talked to them. It's really a sad phenomenon considering a lot of these folks can't speak English or Mandarin correctly, yet they act snobbish as soon as you try to talk to them in Mandarin.

Sometimes when I take the subway by myself, random Singaporean men would come up to me and try to hit on me. Apparently some of them thought I was Korean or Japanese because I just didn't look like the typical mainland Chinese folks they see in Singapore. I think there's a disconnect between their perception of Chinese (uneducated and poor) and reality. Although I can understand why they feel that way about Chinese people given the fact that a lot of the Chinese people in Singapore are workers from rural villages/towns in China who do a lot of the lowly tasks in Singapore. However there are also a lot Malaysian workers in the same boat who get better treatment than these Chinese. So that makes me conclude that maybe there's some kind of "Who hates an Irish man more than an Irish man" syndrome here.

[Child-Bride]

Being of Asian descent, do we just get lumped up along with everyone else who looks Asian, yet are an oddity because we don't speak anything but English, and with a Western accent too?

Just curious.

I'm not sure I like your phraseology - 'being lumped in'?  That has a very negative connotation and in itself shows that you wouldn't ant to be included in society here.
I've never had any trouble here, possibly because I don't have airs about wanting/needing to be different.

as for:

chitown;

I'm curious to know people's thoughts about the perception of African Americans here in Singapore.  Do we get lumped in to the same social grouping as Americans or Africans?  Somehow, I don't get the sense that the social perceptions are the same as those of Caucasian Americans/Westeners.

And on what basis should locals differentiate?  Again the 'lumped in' phrase, amazing. 

Your perception that East and west are different might actually provide you with an answer, yes, they are different.
Do you look different from a Ghanaian, S. African or should we descend into tribal idiosyncrasies.

And:  knock, knock - you are not in North America.