Obama speech- wow

[michael539]

Expertly choreographed, all points covered, pundit positive-  Gergen: This wasn't a speech, it was a symphony.

U.S. disenfrachisee 

[Caligirl]

Rocked the house! His speech was strong, specific & inspirational.

What a triumphant week for the Democrats. Let's hope my fellow American voters don't screw it up again in November.

[Dr. Phil]

Personally I have long since tired of his predictable rhetorical style and as we approach another of your 4 or 8 years cycles, as a European I can only hope you keep the next to yourselves.

And his wife....

US interference in Europe is both provocative and harmful and if we have learnt anything over the past 8 years, and we have indeed learnt a lot, its that all US engagements overseas are wickedly mischievous and mindlessly destructive.

Perhaps the next President will be received well in France and intially one or two Eastern European nations too, but such interest and loyalty will rapidly wane.

Generally, we embrace US goals; well one at least ie CHANGE.
 
We want a change from the glutinous American single-minded pursuit of consumption and profit which has threatened our lifestyles, culture, national security and indeed global security.

What have you done for this world over the past 8 years?
What have you done for Palestine?
How many Iraqis have you killed? 1 million?
Why exactly are we in Afghanistan again?
What happened to Obama Bin Laden?
What damage have you inflicted on Africa making US Aid dependant on abstenance?  But its not funny, just a sick Evangelist game.

Do you still want our earth to be fed by, and dependant on, GM grains from your laboratories?

Yawn. I will say no more else I will be here all day. Whatever happened to US isolationism?

[michael539]

Interesting to get such a subjective and spirited view.  Agreeing with many of your points, how do you think it feels to be a patriotic American with vested interests there (like 5 sons)- and to see the direction we have been going. . . for MORE than 8 yrs?   I am quite sure you don't have a clue. 

Gluttony, debt, short-term driven, disregard for environment, disastrous and destructive policies overseas, what amounts to be an illegal war, a media oligopoly that feeds into division and derision, a business climate always overshadowed by liability and lawsuits, an increasingly uneducated populace, and a failing infrastructure in most of our cities.  The spirit that makes me proud to be an American has been assaulted by a misguided direction, for far too long.  And when you are there, in the cities, you feel it-  the despair, the isolation, the anger- always just below the surface in some sort of festering, bitter sarcasm.  Our own "elephant in the living room."


I too would like to know a bit about change, . . . and isolationism.
 

[Vulcanl]

Haven't seen Obama's speech yet...looking forward to it.

Dr. Phil - Am not going to waste any more time with you.  Your opinion is in the minority in Europe, Thank God for that.

I don't think I am as pessimistic about America'a prospects as others on this board appear to be.  We've had a nightmare for the past (almost 8 years) for sure but it is going to end soon.

The truly impressive aspect about our system (and credit goes to our founding fathers) is that is was created with checks and balances that are still in place 230 years later.

This form of democracy, it is our gift to the World.  It is the most open system currently in place and it is rightly so the envy of the World.

[Dr. Phil]

Interesting to get such a subjective and spirited view.  Agreeing with many of your points, how do you think it feels to be a patriotic American with vested interests there (like 5 sons)- and to see the direction we have been going. . . for MORE than 8 yrs?   I am quite sure you don't have a clue. 

Gluttony, debt, short-term driven, disregard for environment, disastrous and destructive policies overseas, what amounts to be an illegal war, a media oligopoly that feeds into division and derision, a business climate always overshadowed by liability and lawsuits, an increasingly uneducated populace, and a failing infrastructure in most of our cities.  The spirit that makes me proud to be an American has been assaulted by a misguided direction, for far too long.  And when you are there, in the cities, you feel it-  the despair, the isolation, the anger- always just below the surface in some sort of festering, bitter sarcasm.  Our own "elephant in the living room."


I too would like to know a bit about change, . . . and isolationism.
 

But the problem with isolationism, shutting the door on the outside world, is that the problems remain within.

Let us be frank, you Americans aspire to great ideals yet these are merely the means to materialistic ends. You beat the drum of multi-culturalism and then bitch and complain when your population is amongst the most uneducated and violent on earth. Have you taken a good look at yourselves lately?

When I was a child, I could close my eyes and imagine what an American family looked like, how they lived, how they played, their education, customs, lifestyle etc. Their ideals.
Today, who can do this? We no longer recognise you. And your disastrous social engineering goals have had a negative impact on gullible European societies who also (and have always) worshipped their dollar (or gilder) above all else; not just the Dutch.
Your melting pot has concocted the most odious and distasteful slop imaginable.

Please dont quote your Founding Fathers; have you no respect? This is your greatest betrayal.

Yes I too have immediate family who are Americans, lawyers, brokers... They too despair; I also think your indebtedness will bring us all down.
There is nothing but clouds on the horizon.

Vulcani, still whistling in the dark? What checks and balances do you refer? Please explain?

[michael539]

Yes, I have taken a very hard look at "ourselves" lately- for about three years now. I can only reflect on my own experiences and how they have impacted me and those that I love.

America is a great country.  I was raised with ideals of hope, charity, love, unity, acceptance, education, living a balanced life.  Many of us have these ideals- and are very displeased at the state of our nation. 

I was fortunate in that I was able to achieve adequate financial gain through the ownership of several very successful restaurants.  I always said that the best charity I could give to someone was a stable, good paying job.  .  . and I did, to many.  I was so "there." I had everything that the world's best marketers taught us to want. And boy did they teach us to want. The dream slowing dying of the cancer of excess and want, a slavery borne of excessive consumption, short term gain, and self-willed ignorance. 

So I had the big house, and literally the fleet of the finest euro cars. . . . . . . . . 
And I was miserable.  The dream, that never-dying American dream- it got lost in the clutter of our own excesses.  And so did I.

I walked away. I sold out on the businesses. And when my wife got a job here, I left. 
I don't have to sit in 8 lanes of standstill traffic wondering how much fossil fuel is converted to pollution on football fields of freeway.  I don't have to watch a 10 minute close up on Britney Spear's lawyer while waiting to hear a 10 second spot on 12,000 dead in east Africa. I don't have to ride by the Boulevard crack whores taking my son to school or listen to the despair of the vets talking at the local Poncey pub. Not for a while.  In 1978, we were taught quite extensively about global warming at the university I attended. 
Last year, there were two unassociated articles running on the same day in the same newspaper.
article 1: The Bush administration remains unmoved on their position regarding Global Warming.
article 2: The Bush administration expressed concern over the Russian's planting of flags in the                 portions of the North Pole, that have melted due to Global Warming.
God help us.

America is a great country.  Americans are a great people.  Government, Big Biz, and Media have distorted, twisted, mangled what we are, what we aspire to, and how we are perceived in the world.  But they are not us.  We are not them.  However, we do share a degree of culpability because we bought in to it.  Out of fear and insecurity and want, we bought in to it.  I know I did. . . .   for a while.  But no more.  No more.

Humbly so, I am at a time and a place to evaluate what IS important- and what it does mean to be an American. 
For I am an American. 

 










   

[Rosie]

I did watch the speech this morning, and was a bit disappointed.  I felt much more moved by Bill's speech yesterday.  Somehow Barack just didn't grab me in the same way.

Still I think he's the best bet for the US.  Just hope they can find their way to elect a black man to the White House.  If they don't then they deserve whatever another Republican term brings them.

[tweek]

Why oh why do so many non-Americans think this election is ultimately only going to be about race?? I don't doubt that race will be a factor for some, but I think they will be a minority of voters. Not everyone who votes against Obama in November will be doing so just because he is black. That's ridiculous. Do keep in mind that there are actual philosophical differences between Democrats and Republicans and I daresay that a good portion of people vote according to those and not the names on the ballots.

[Dr. Phil]

Yes, I have taken a very hard look at "ourselves" lately- for about three years now. I can only reflect on my own experiences and how they have impacted me and those that I love.

America is a great country.  I was raised with ideals of hope, charity, love, unity, acceptance, education, living a balanced life.  Many of us have these ideals- and are very displeased at the state of our nation. 

I was fortunate in that I was able to achieve adequate financial gain through the ownership of several very successful restaurants.  I always said that the best charity I could give to someone was a stable, good paying job.  .  . and I did, to many.  I was so "there." I had everything that the world's best marketers taught us to want. And boy did they teach us to want. The dream slowing dying of the cancer of excess and want, a slavery borne of excessive consumption, short term gain, and self-willed ignorance. 

So I had the big house, and literally the fleet of the finest euro cars. . . . . . . . . 
And I was miserable.  The dream, that never-dying American dream- it got lost in the clutter of our own excesses.  And so did I.

I walked away. I sold out on the businesses. And when my wife got a job here, I left. 
I don't have to sit in 8 lanes of standstill traffic wondering how much fossil fuel is converted to pollution on football fields of freeway.  I don't have to watch a 10 minute close up on Britney Spear's lawyer while waiting to hear a 10 second spot on 12,000 dead in east Africa. I don't have to ride by the Boulevard crack whores taking my son to school or listen to the despair of the vets talking at the local Poncey pub. Not for a while.  In 1978, we were taught quite extensively about global warming at the university I attended. 
Last year, there were two unassociated articles running on the same day in the same newspaper.
article 1: The Bush administration remains unmoved on their position regarding Global Warming.
article 2: The Bush administration expressed concern over the Russian's planting of flags in the                 portions of the North Pole, that have melted due to Global Warming.
God help us.

America is a great country.  Americans are a great people.  Government, Big Biz, and Media have distorted, twisted, mangled what we are, what we aspire to, and how we are perceived in the world.  But they are not us.  We are not them.  However, we do share a degree of culpability because we bought in to it.  Out of fear and insecurity and want, we bought in to it.  I know I did. . . .   for a while.  But no more.  No more.

Humbly so, I am at a time and a place to evaluate what IS important- and what it does mean to be an American. 
For I am an American. 

Michael, I dont doubt your love of America.

I agree its a great country.

I wonder whether you all deserve it?

The legacy you and your children will always inherit, which even pre-dates the Founding Fathers (since the best blood of many European and Asian nations were the pioneers), and includes the US Constitution and Bill of Rights. These present a fine example to fledgling democracies (especially is Africa). It gave (past tense) them a blueprint for a democracy and when push came to shove and independant or non-aligned nations even in Europe had to chose, they chose right over might, whatever struggles and sacrifices were required to prevail.

When your elected American leaders treat the moral standards you have championed with the blood of generations of your children, with so little worth, others pick up on this and the standards worldwide fall. And respect for America also falls.

I came home tonight and have received numerous emails from family in USA all saying "Obama, what an incredible speech...." So it appears the "ayes" have it.

Lets hope he can do justice to the majority especially those sacrificing personal health and family life (hopefully not irreversibly hurt) for service to an unworthy CIC and an obscure cause overseas and like you, he can make a genuine attempt to build a nation rather than a corporation.

But if McCane selects Lieberman as his running mate, for the Jewish vote, you may see your dreams fade.

There is a difference between isolationism (which is unhealthy) and taking care of the US population at home, before striking deals to exploit cheap labour and tax-free corporate profits outside USA with FTAs and JVs. You must give priority to domestic employment and support Health & Safety and Environmental standards globally and I do not refer to global warming directly or advocate abandoning the US automobile. I mean lock US employers into paying decent salaries, healthcare, pensions etc. If your market is closed to those who refuse, you will prevail and it really will not be an insurmountable expense or make USA less competetive.

This is what a government is elected to do; prepare the home fields, ensure favourable climate etc for the farmers to sow their seeds.

There is nothing wrong with patrotism; it isn't racist as we are so often warned (until there is a war). If you cant be proud of your own country, you will never respect mine.

Good luck.

 

[Dr. Phil]

Sara Palin..
Ok back to reality.
Its the USA after all.
Ok so its The West Wing vs Commander-In-Chief. 

[michael539]

Thanks for your insight Dr. Phil.  
Do we deserve it?  I don't know how to even address that question.  I think that only our actions as citizens, workers, and towards others (in both the local and global community) can only answer that question.  The doomsayer buzzword in the U.S. is not "deserve" as much as "entitled."  There is a sense of entitlement in my country that is rattling its very foundations.  

In the case of my own sons, it has been difficult to teach them that they are not "entitled" to 500.00/month cell phone bills, a new car with insurance paid, the newest game equipment, designer clothes, the newest I-phone, I-Pod and laptop, and a personal credit card for fun with friends.  Like the American college kids that committed suicide because they worked up 10,000.00 credit card bills- using the very cards that banks gave them upon their admittance to college.  Or the Nigerian immigrant (and there are many) that buys a new Lexus only to lose his home 4 mos. later.  It seems that in the U.S., advertising and banking have really worked overtime to tell us what we should have, loan us the money to procure it, only for us to face the consequences thereafter.  Unfortunately, our government and big business have often been behaving in the same manner- if not worse.  

And for anyone that questions my patriotism (and thanks Dr. Phil for not questioning it)- as an American, I can only say- look at our national debt, our social security system with baby boomers reaching retirement, our health care system, our banking system, the objectives of much of our foreign policy- all the while, our infrastructure is crumbling.  Frankly, it is very unpatriotic to NOT look at those things.

So I am for Obama.  And before that, I was for Ron Paul.  Whoever has the least amount of experience inside the beltway, that's my man (or woman).

For me, the question is whether we have what it takes as a country - to change.  
Or will the note fall due before we are willing?

[leo_7630]

"So I am for Obama.  And before that, I was for Ron Paul.  Whoever has the least amount of experience inside the beltway, that's my man (or woman)"

u got ur wish...sarah palin it is...:-)

[michael539]

leo-  you got me, or should i say- they got me.
absolutely frightening.

[leo_7630]

to be honest i dont know the american woman psyche. would the clinton supporters(women) and other independents (women), who might have felt their candidate couldnt get through fall for this McCain Gimmick and vote for republicans?