Why is US throwing money to Pakistan??

[working_mom]

I am really amazed by the way US is throwing money at Pakistan in the name of "War on Terror". Especially since, the audit on the money actually spent on this war is dubious at best and most of the money is actually being passed to Taliban in Swat valley to buy peace with the Tribals there.  Today there is a news that there has been an terrorist attack on Sri Lankan cricketers who were currently touring Pakistan (Are they crazy or is this some kind of human sacrifice by SL Cricket Board to win the 2011 World Cup?  ). Pakistan is not far from formenting trouble in the neighbourhood...recent example being Bangladesh with recent reports suggesting that Pakistan has a hand in formenting trouble in Bangladesh which lead to a mutiny by Border Gaurds against the democratically elected President and the release of AQ.Khan the nuclear salesman and not to forget the numerous terror attacks in India. Yes, an unstable Pakistan with notorious mix of nuclear weapons and terrorists is a migraine to the entire world especially its immediate neighbours India and Afghanistan. But, US is letting Pakistan hold its nuclear weapons as a blackmail to cave into all sorts of demands....This happened during the Afghan war to drive the Soviets out. They raised the Taliban and it came back to haunt them and its happening again. When will US ever learn???

[TheWrathOfGrapes]

Well, this is just not cricket......

[Dr. Phil]

Prior to the election of G.W. Bush I said that the four greatest threats were Iran, north Korea, Israel and Pakistan. After 9-11 Pakistani terrorism has been the main threat.

The Bush Administratio has pumped billions into Pakistan and the former president played a clever game, enrishing himself, rebuilding the Pakistani military and giving Al Qaeda sanctuary.

Today Al Qaeda is close to controlling Pakistan and the nuclear weapons. The USA is still in denial. Mrs Clinton visits China with her begging bowl and tells the Chinese that human rights is a distant second after the economy.

My fear is that Pakistan will be the second country in the history of the world to be nuked. But by whom? 

   

[working_mom]

My fear is that Pakistan will be the second country in the history of the world to be nuked. But by whom?

Pakistan's enemy is within Pakistan in the form of numerous terrorists receiving state patronage and I am afraid one day these guys are going to gain access to the Pakistani nukes and they may end up nuking Pakistan and taking down India and Afghanistan in the process.

[Dr. Phil]

My fear is that Pakistan will be the second country in the history of the world to be nuked. But by whom?

Pakistan's enemy is within Pakistan in the form of numerous terrorists receiving state patronage and I am afraid one day these guys are going to gain access to the Pakistani nukes and they may end up nuking Pakistan and taking down India and Afghanistan in the process.

No, I think Al Qaeda trains political revolutionaries with a little more sense. They will not bomb themselves, only the "soldiers" do that.

Pakistan is a lost cause. It has been for a long time. It has become increasingly emboldened with the billions of USD which has modernised the military and has enriched Al Qaeda; why do you think Sharaf was never seriously challenged?

Pakistan's military intelligence is allied to Al Qaeda and Al Qaeda's leverage, like George Bush's "attraction" is religious.

Religion is a powerful weapon which will, for sure, attract the suicidal foot soliers ready to make the ultimate sacrifice. It was the weapon of choice for George Bush and also Tony Blair. Today Gordon Brown wants to meet the pope.

But who is more pernicious, Israel or Al Qaeda?

The USA is too seriously compromised with its blind support of Israel.

Al Qaeda is becoming a dominant force also in north Africa. The way the west tackles piracy off Somalia is both sad and telling. Their terms of reference prohibit them from getting involved. 
We have become paralysed with indecision or wrong choices due to political correctness and in UK New Labour know nothing else; its not just an ideology, its a way of life.

Not so the PRC. If they see gunmen 50 nautical miles off the coast looking for Chinese merchantmen to attack, they will do their duty. They can sort this scourge out in a very short time and I think they deserve the right to do so. 

The west's indebtedness and Bush's eight years of chaos, has opened the doors for PRC to become the global super power and US criticisms will fall on deaf ears since PRC, not USA, holds the moral high ground.

[working_mom]

Al Quaeda is just one of the terrorist group operating in Pakistan...You have LET, JUD and numerous other groups which are equally powerful...Yes Al Qaeda is far more sophisticated but i doubt if LET is...Chances are they might fire a N.Korean made nuke aimed towards India and it might just fall short of target 

On a serious note though, the collateral damage on such a scenario is going to be devastating to Pakistan's neighbours. The fact that there are 3 countries in this neighbourhood with nuclear weapons (China, Pakistan and India) makes it a terrible scenario. I know for sure that India will not use nuclear weapons in any war (we have had many wars with Pakistan after attaining covert nuclear status) but i am not sure about Pakistan or China.

Speaking of China, all great powers have had downfalls be it Germany, Japan, Britain,Soviet Union and now the US. China will not be far behind with a restless migrant rural population losing their jobs due to recession, suppression of tibetians, Uighurs and other ethnic minorities, skewed up 1 child policy making Chinese demography more aged and tensions with Taiwan....not everything is hunky-dory in current China. With the current immigration policy of US more Chinese and Indians are going to return to their homeland. For Indians the adjustment is going to be relatively easy (except adjustment to the red tape, corruption and a non-performing, un-accountable Govt ) because they are returning from one democracy to another but not so for 2nd and 3rd Generation Chinese brought up in Western school of thought. They will find it hard to work under a suppressing regime and I wont be surprised if China goes the USSR way.

But Pakistan is turning out to be a migraine and last heard the current Obama administration is planning to pump in more aid in the form of military and financial assistance and this is being proposed by John Kerry who is overriding concerns by Joe Biden. The fact that US has not learnt from past experience in Afghanistan when Soviets invaded is astounding. Obama is planning to deploy more troops in Afghanistan and its going to be an irony that these brave soilders are going to fight against men who will be using american money and weapons against them.

[Dr. Phil]

working mom, last night I watched a documentary about the sinking of the passenger ship "Wilhelm Gustloff" in the icy waters of the Baltic Sea in 1945, torpedoed by a Russian submarine, with the greatest loss of life of 5,348 souls. This dwarfs Titanic.

The documentary gave a vivid description of the suffering of the civilian passengers especially the children. Survival in such icy waters was said to be 2 minutes but it is actually much less.

So, knowing only too well how Pakistan has been "begging" to be nuked for the past eight years and the US response has been to buy, buy, buy what they thought was time but which has proven to be an investment in their enemy's arsenal, we are deeper in the quagmire through our own foolishness.

However as a mom I am sure you can imagine, whilst we know regretably Al Qaeda will not, the impact of a nuclear detonation on the people of any nation will cause indescribable suffering you must rise above your anger focus on the faces of the children, confused yet uncomplaining, moments from death, looking into their parents' faces for reassurance.

Is it worth it?
 

[so what]

Working Mom,

Your latest post is biassed and chauvinistic.
Lets not forget that Pakistan is a creation of the Indian government, and now it has become a "migraine" from which the whole world suffers.

Granted, Pakistan seems more likely to use nuclear weapons, however stating that India should receive a different consideration because it has never used nuclear weapons in their wars with Pakistan, is unfounded and highly biassed.
Neither Pakistan or China so far have used nuclear weapons in their conflicts and are therefor entitled to the same treatement and (mis)trust.

Whilst the conflicts between India and Pakistan is purely an internal conflict that has been initiated by Indians through seperation of Pakistan, it may well be that the intervention by the USA might be one of the reasons a nuclear war has not started yet between these two countries.

If all Indians are afraid of Pakistan using their nuclear arsenal, why would they not encourage the US to put in even more money?
Surely, withdrawing aid from the region and creating a bankrupt Pakistan is a far more fearful scenario if not a death warrant for countless Indians.

India is well known for its internal struggle, often accompanied by horrible acts of violence and murder, political instability, enormous economic problems, lack of control of the various races, religions and believes.
India is also a country where politicians are not only found to be utterly corrupt, they get assassinated...and with them countless civilians.

On the scale of terrorism and nuclear threat, India equals if not excels Pakistan.
Pakistan may be a breeding ground for terrorism and Al Quaeda, but has become so with the full cooperation of India practicing intolerance.

Be happy the world cares and be happy financial assistance is offered, without it India and Pakistan would surely have exterminated each other long time ago.

So working mom, after you have finished your Paki-bashing, perhaps you can continue with some other popular Indian pastimes such as Tamil-bashing, Lanka-bashing, Sikh-bashing or Bangla-bashing.

[TheWrathOfGrapes]

I know for sure that India will not use nuclear weapons in any war (we have had many wars with Pakistan after attaining covert nuclear status) but i am not sure about Pakistan or China.

Speaking of China, all great powers have had downfalls be it Germany, Japan, Britain,Soviet Union and now the US. China will not be far behind with a restless migrant rural population losing their jobs due to recession, suppression of tibetians, Uighurs and other ethnic minorities, skewed up 1 child policy making Chinese demography more aged and tensions with Taiwan....not everything is hunky-dory in current China.

working_mom, your mom mind is not working and your history is history rusty.

Let me guess - you are Indian/NRI?

China will not be the last great power to have a downfall. It was the FIRST great power to have a downfall. If my history serves me right, Chinese technology and culture were at its height during the Song and Tang dynasties. When China was the Middle Kingdom and the Centre of the Earth, the people in the uncivilised world were still living in caves (okay, I exaggerate a bit). And I think China is very aware of its history - China had a great fall.

[working_mom]

so many posts to reply  ....Let me take one by one...Starting with Dr.Phil

[working_mom]

working mom, last night I watched a documentary about the sinking of the passenger ship "Wilhelm Gustloff" in the icy waters of the Baltic Sea in 1945, torpedoed by a Russian submarine, with the greatest loss of life of 5,348 souls. This dwarfs Titanic.

The documentary gave a vivid description of the suffering of the civilian passengers especially the children. Survival in such icy waters was said to be 2 minutes but it is actually much less.

So, knowing only too well how Pakistan has been "begging" to be nuked for the past eight years and the US response has been to buy, buy, buy what they thought was time but which has proven to be an investment in their enemy's arsenal, we are deeper in the quagmire through our own foolishness.

However as a mom I am sure you can imagine, whilst we know regretably Al Qaeda will not, the impact of a nuclear detonation on the people of any nation will cause indescribable suffering you must rise above your anger focus on the faces of the children, confused yet uncomplaining, moments from death, looking into their parents' faces for reassurance.

Is it worth it?

Definitely not worth it at all! Which posts of mine prescribe for a nuclear holocust ? In fact its the other way around!! Nuking Pakistan is not an option not just because of the huge loss of human lives but also because India shares borders with Pakistan and they will be definite impact on the Indian populace in the border areas (Unless India decides to move a huge population from the border which will alert Pakistan and doesnt make sense!) I will never prescribe for a nuclear war.

[Old Mike]

So What wrote:

Lets not forget that Pakistan is a creation of the Indian government, and now it has become a "migraine" from which the whole world suffers.

Actually the partition of India was one of the last acts of the British Raj. It happened, to Ghandi's great distress, because Muslim and Hindu indians were unable to cooperate in the formation of an integrated Indian state.
Based on 1951 Census of displaced persons, 7,226,000 Muslims went to Pakistan from India while 7,249,000 Hindus and Sikhs moved to India from Pakistan immediately after partition. Violence and murder took place during this migration, with the number of people killed estimated to be between 200,000 and 1 million

[working_mom]

Working Mom,

Your latest post is biassed and chauvinistic.
Lets not forget that Pakistan is a creation of the Indian government, and now it has become a "migraine" from which the whole world suffers.

Granted, Pakistan seems more likely to use nuclear weapons, however stating that India should receive a different consideration because it has never used nuclear weapons in their wars with Pakistan, is unfounded and highly biassed.
Neither Pakistan or China so far have used nuclear weapons in their conflicts and are therefor entitled to the same treatement and (mis)trust.

Whilst the conflicts between India and Pakistan is purely an internal conflict that has been initiated by Indians through seperation of Pakistan, it may well be that the intervention by the USA might be one of the reasons a nuclear war has not started yet between these two countries.

If all Indians are afraid of Pakistan using their nuclear arsenal, why would they not encourage the US to put in even more money?
Surely, withdrawing aid from the region and creating a bankrupt Pakistan is a far more fearful scenario if not a death warrant for countless Indians.

India is well known for its internal struggle, often accompanied by horrible acts of violence and murder, political instability, enormous economic problems, lack of control of the various races, religions and believes.
India is also a country where politicians are not only found to be utterly corrupt, they get assassinated...and with them countless civilians.

On the scale of terrorism and nuclear threat, India equals if not excels Pakistan.
Pakistan may be a breeding ground for terrorism and Al Quaeda, but has become so with the full cooperation of India practicing intolerance.

Be happy the world cares and be happy financial assistance is offered, without it India and Pakistan would surely have exterminated each other long time ago.

So working mom, after you have finished your Paki-bashing, perhaps you can continue with some other popular Indian pastimes such as Tamil-bashing, Lanka-bashing, Sikh-bashing or Bangla-bashing.

Your latest post is biassed and chauvinistic.
Lets not forget that Pakistan is a creation of the Indian government, and now it has become a "migraine" from which the whole world suffers.

ROFLMAO! Look who is talkin about bias here!! Most of your posts nay rantings are not worth answering at all...But hell! I have some time to waste today so here we go  

You seem to be reeking ignorance....Though i do have some time to waste i dont want to waste it on teaching the sub-continent history to biased Anti-indian bigots.... so you may wanna google on the creation of Pakistan!! India created Pakistan and I created the world indeed!

Granted, Pakistan seems more likely to use nuclear weapons, however stating that India should receive a different consideration because it has never used nuclear weapons in their wars with Pakistan, is unfounded and highly biassed.
Neither Pakistan or China so far have used nuclear weapons in their conflicts and are therefor entitled to the same treatement and (mis)trust.

As an Indian I can speak only for India and I did when I stated India will not be the first one to use the nuclear weapons and India commits to this by having a no-first use policy. Neither Pakistan nor China has this policy....

If all Indians are afraid of Pakistan using their nuclear arsenal, why would they not encourage the US to put in even more money?
Surely, withdrawing aid from the region and creating a bankrupt Pakistan is a far more fearful scenario if not a death warrant for countless Indians.

Of course, it makes sense for India to see Pakistan a success instead of a failed State as Pakistan's neighbour we have much more to loose than any other country....What we are asking is for the accountability of the money that is being spent on this war on terror...Of course, that will be wrong to some biased minds.

India is well known for its internal struggle, often accompanied by horrible acts of violence and murder, political instability, enormous economic problems, lack of control of the various races, religions and believes.
India is also a country where politicians are not only found to be utterly corrupt, they get assassinated...and with them countless civilians.

Yes India is no Eden...but its a democracy where everything is reported and held accountable by an open media...We dont sweep things under the carpet unlike some other countries. And guess what a billion people are living there, satisfied and happy...Yes the system is not perfect and yes people crib about it and yes it could be better. Please do let me know a country which is perfect and can hold a billion people and satisfy all of them and you can perhaps arrange for a mass migration when you are it...You sure seem to be having a bleeding heart!

So working mom, after you have finished your Paki-bashing, perhaps you can continue with some other popular Indian pastimes such as Tamil-bashing, Lanka-bashing, Sikh-bashing or Bangla-bashing.

All this deserves is ROFLMAO!

Tchau!!!

[working_mom]

Actually the partition of India was one of the last acts of the British Raj. It happened, to Ghandi's great distress, because Muslim and Hindu indians were unable to cooperate in the formation of an integrated Indian state.
Based on 1951 Census of displaced persons, 7,226,000 Muslims went to Pakistan from India while 7,249,000 Hindus and Sikhs moved to India from Pakistan immediately after partition. Violence and murder took place during this migration, with the number of people killed estimated to be between 200,000 and 1 million

OM, a small correction! The Partition happened because Indian Muslim League under Jinnah decided it wanted a seperate Islamic Nation and most of the mass migration was of Hindus from Pakistan and voulantry migration of muslims. Please note, India has the 2nd largest muslim population in the world after Indonesia

[working_mom]

working_mom, your mom mind is not working and your history is history rusty.

Let me guess - you are Indian/NRI?

China will not be the last great power to have a downfall. It was the FIRST great power to have a downfall. If my history serves me right, Chinese technology and culture were at its height during the Song and Tang dynasties. When China was the Middle Kingdom and the Centre of the Earth, the people in the uncivilised world were still living in caves (okay, I exaggerate a bit). And I think China is very aware of its history - China had a great fall.

Well, If it was history I could have started with the Harrapan and Mohinjodaro Civilization but I was talking about mordern or rather relatively modern history.

And to answer your question...Yup, I am an Non-resident Indian.