Keeping a Concubine

[Pragmo]

It's all about pragmatism. Singaporeans and Singapore Inc tend to view the world as it is rather than as it should be. It's a mindset.

The wife in question probably came to terms with the situation- ok my husband cheated, thats what they do, now lets all sit together and figure out what this means. She would have had her bottom line , largely to do with assets I imagine.

Singapore Inc. adopts the same thought process on a larger scale with prostitution. Its like "hey thats pretty sordid but we are a port town, its going to happen lets push it to Geyland (and other locales) regulate it , control it to a degree and make some money while we are at it

[makingsenseofthings]

Well, if staying married and keeping the family together is much lesser effort than a divorce, many wives would put up with it.

It ain't that easy for a middle aged lady for get a man half her age if she isn't filthy rich, let alone a man the same age who would care for her kids as well.

Normal life that you're used to, versus messed up lonely life. It's easy to choose between the two.

[JR8]

A kubes blog? Yeah... do it!

[pykeee]

yeah Kubes, your opinions and writings are quite intriguing. do start a blog and let us know the link

[Kubes.SG]

It's all about pragmatism. Singaporeans and Singapore Inc tend to view the world as it is rather than as it should be. It's a mindset.

The wife in question probably came to terms with the situation- ok my husband cheated, thats what they do, now lets all sit together and figure out what this means. She would have had her bottom line , largely to do with assets I imagine.

Singapore Inc. adopts the same thought process on a larger scale with prostitution. Its like "hey thats pretty sordid but we are a port town, its going to happen lets push it to Geyland (and other locales) regulate it , control it to a degree and make some money while we are at it

Hmmmm.  This is a very interesting response.  But a cop out.  I have not been to any Chinese weddings but I always assumed that the wedding vows of any culture (except where polygamy is legal/practiced) would include a declaration of faithfulness. A quick Google found a bunch of traditional Christian wedding vows.  Since SG is very conservative and very Christian it is worth reviewing these:


I take you ,______________, to be my wife/husband and I promise before God and all who are present here to be your loving and faithful husband/wife, as long as our lives shall last. I will serve you with tenderness and respect, and encourage you to develop God’s gifts in you.

Wedding Vow Variant 1

I, ________________, take you, _____________, to be my wife/husband; and I promise before God and these witnesses to be your loving and faithful husband/wife; in plenty and in want; in joy and in sorrow; in sickness and in health; as long as we both shall live.

Wedding Vow Variant 2

Before God and these witnesses, I, ________________, take you, _______________, to be my husband/wife, and I promise to love you, and to be faithful to you as long as we both shall live.

Wedding Vow Variant 3

Do you, _____________, take this woman/man, _______________, to be your wife/husband, according to God’s holy decree; do you promise to be to him/her a loving and loyal husband/wife, to cherish and keep her/him in sickness and in health; and, forsaking all others, to be faithful only to him/her as long as you both shall live?

Answer: I do.

Wedding Vow Variant 4

_________________, will you have this woman/man to be your wife/husband to live together according to God’s decree in the holy estate of marriage? Will you love her/him, comfort her/him, honour and keep her/him, in sickness and in health, and forsaking all others, faithfully keep to her/him alone, so long as you both shall live?

Answer: I will

Wedding Vow Variant 5

I, _____________, take you, ______________, to be my wife/husband, according to God’s holy decree: to have and to hold from this day forward, for better for worse, for richer for poorer, in sickness and in health, to love and to cherish, till death do we part: and to that I pledge you my faithfulness.


Wedding Vow Variant 6

I _____, take you ______, to be my wedded wife/husband. To have and to hold, from this day forward, for better, for worse, for richer, for poorer, in sickness or in health, to love and to cherish 'till death do us part. And hereto I pledge you my faithfulness.


Seems to me that the "practicality" that Pragmo speaks of is really just about money.  Can the wife still get enough money and material things to keep her happy?  This is more important that honesty, respect, honor, health or love.   Kind of the same reason the 22 yo girlfriend beds the 55 yo husband.

As much as I try I can't get away from the evidence that just about everything here is about the money.

[Kubes.SG]

Blogs you say.   I already have a couple, but I won't be providing any links here - sorry.

But I must admit, the idea of having one where I could get this site's BMs to post comments and thoughts would be fantastic.  I would just love to delete their postings for no obvious reasons.   Maybe I could call it www.expatinsingapore.com?  Can?

[BoardManager]

Kubes
If your posts do not constantly and consistently come across as offensive and obnoxious then you can be sure we will leave you and your posts alone.

Seriously, you should stick to posting fair and objective comments; make observations for all you like ... but when you try to put others down then we draw a line.

[Kubes.SG]

I hope someone took a video cam to this meeting looks like the makings of a fantastic reality TV show, maybe even Neo could turn it into a Doco-movie.

Fans let down by Jack Neo
His affair with 22-year-old model runs against the moralistic tone in his movies, they say
By adeline chia

FANS of Jack Neo are disappointed with the news of the local movie director's extramarital affair, which made the front pages of all three Chinese papers yesterday.

Marketing and sales executive Vincent Chua, 55, who has watched many of his movies, said yesterday: 'In his movies, he asks people to be good, honest and true to their families. But in real life, he can do anything. There is really a conflict.'

Industry watchers said the scandal may change the 50-year-old's image and the way people view his movies.

News of the film-maker's two-year affair with 22-year-old freelance model Wendy Chong broke in the Lianhe Wanbao evening newspaper last Saturday. Chong told The Straits Times on Saturday night that it was she who had alerted the media to a meeting between Neo, his wife and herself at Crowne Plaza hotel in Changi airport on Friday.

The meeting reportedly dragged on for four hours. Chong's father and sister later came on the scene. Neo's pastor, church friend and manager were also present.

Chong said she had decided to make the affair public because she felt hurt and betrayed by Neo. She denied that she was using him to break into show business.

[Kubes.SG]

Kubes
If your posts do not constantly and consistently come across as offensive and obnoxious then you can be sure we will leave you and your posts alone.

Seriously, you should stick to posting fair and objective comments; make observations for all you like ... but when you try to put others down then we draw a line.

Firstly thanks for the response.  I appreciate the fact that you have provided some feedback. 

I have always been careful to only present my postings in an honest and truthful way, based on facts, the evidence and leveraging my and others' experiences..  Since there is so much positive spin coming from traditional media in SG and virtually none that raises legitimate concerns or challenges the status quo, I decide years ago to provide that "anti-spin" to make sure the truth and facts got some visibility..

Sadly some people find the truths and facts without the sugar-coating of positive spin (or outright exclusion) to be very uncomfortable.  Some may call it "offensive and obnoxious".

I will be careful to not put people down.

[BoardManager]

Thank you for that. Now we can be friends again. 

Do think for a moment about the things you have been saying about the local populace. You cannot seriously tell me that these same characteristics and traits do not exist anywhere else. I travel extensively a fair bit and take these on my chin. I do not do a song and dance about them. But you seem to nit pick and deliberately highlight these to make a campaign of it every time, as if it gives you great pleasure to mock the locals and to put them down.

And no, we do not encourage political discussions. It has never been our purpose to do so. 

[Pragmo]

Look on the acceptance of polygamy (for that it what it is) as a harm minimisation strategy.

We have this approach with various other forms of social ills such as alcohol abuse, smoking, gambling, abortion, prostitution etc. In all cases most societies agree that these pastimes are less than desirable. And yet empirical evidence over the last few thousand years of human history indicate that human beings will do them anyway.

Prohibition has been tried as a form of social engineering by various societies, almost always as a failure. Think of the United States banning booze as a famous example. All it does is drive the behaviour underground away from societies reach and ability to control.

So most societies have adopted various forms of harm minimisation, allowing a degree of tolerance either legally or not, and attempted to manage the fallout rather than ban said behaviours outright. By regulating  (or semi regulating) undesirable habits you can minimise the externalities to a degree.

Look on Asian attitudes to polygamy in this context. The Muslims are probably the most honest, they allow men to have up to four wives but on the proviso that they are all equal in status, and all children have the same inheritance rights.  The main benefactors of such a policy are children of the "other" women who gain legal protection that they would otherwise not have in a society that prohibits polygamy.

Chinese society also regognised polygamy, modern Chinese have a "virtual" approach, the alpha male may have one official wife, but through concubines, girlfriends in Batma etc, may have a haram of virtual wives as well. This is accepted at least in an unofficial sense by the first wife, as the lady above so eloquently put it "by closing one eye"

[$Pripps]

Thank you for that. Now we can be friends again. 

Do think for a moment about the things you have been saying about the local populace. You cannot seriously tell me that these same characteristics and traits do not exist anywhere else. I travel extensively a fair bit and take these on my chin. I do not do a song and dance about them. But you seem to nit pick and deliberately highlight these to make a campaign of it every time, as if it gives you great pleasure to mock the locals and to put them down.

And no, we do not encourage political discussions. It has never been our purpose to do so. 

What exactly do you encourage?

E.g. if somebody posts a link or recommends a good eating place it gets deleted. Regardless whether the poster has an agenda or not it should not be deleted, it should be up to the reader to form his/her opinion from the message.

[maybemaybenot]

Regardless whether the poster has an agenda or not it should not be deleted, it should be up to the reader to form his/her opinion from the message.

I disagree to a certain extent.  If someone is blatantly trying to advertise for free then it should go but if someone's posted something like 'what do you think of xxx restaurant' and the BM suspects it could be someone trying to sneakily advertise their own place then I think it should stay because people who've been there could very well put that they thought the service sucked or something and although they are probably being honest, it kind of backfires at the person who posted it trying to drum up business.  So I think it depends on the way the post is written.

[Don't believe the Kubes]

Hmmmm.  This is a very interesting response.  But a cop out.  I have not been to any Chinese weddings but I always assumed that the wedding vows of any culture (except where polygamy is legal/practiced) would include a declaration of faithfulness. A quick Google found a bunch of traditional Christian wedding vows.  Since SG is very conservative and very Christian it is worth reviewing these:

Kubes, please refrain from saying that your posts are based on facts because that's just crap. Christians are the minority here, and a very, very small minority at that.

What transpired between Jack Neo, his wife and his mistress is nothing more than boring celebrity gossip, and a second-rate starlet trying to grab a headline.Yawn. You are little better than the tabloid editor happy to exploit someone's private affairs, or the bored commuter who gobbles it up because he or she has no life.

[Kubes.SG]

Thank you for that. Now we can be friends again.  

Do think for a moment about the things you have been saying about the local populace. You cannot seriously tell me that these same characteristics and traits do not exist anywhere else. I travel extensively a fair bit and take these on my chin. I do not do a song and dance about them. But you seem to nit pick and deliberately highlight these to make a campaign of it every time, as if it gives you great pleasure to mock the locals and to put them down.

And no, we do not encourage political discussions. It has never been our purpose to do so.  

Lets get this right, I don't intend to mock the locals.  Instead I mock the locals' lies, distortions, misinformation  and behaviors.  And the term "locals" includes the authorities too.  However, if the "locals" produced balanced dialogs that recognized the failures, poverty, destitution, problems, incompetency, corruption, etc. that exists here then I would not go it so hard pushing for the whole truth.  

I am pleased for Singapore's fantastic successes - key reasons why we are in Singapore.  However the official message-track is almost completely 1-sided with positive stories about Singapore and the denial that there is anything bad or dire here, and the claims that everyone and everything here is successful.  This distortion is what really annoys me.   It is so blatant, so rampant that
though proudly claiming to be a 'First-World' country, Singapore was ranked 141 out of 167 in 2007 World Press Freedom Index (Reporters Without Borders) ahead of Afghanistan at 142. In the same year, Singapore was ranked 157 out of 195 countries in the Freedom of the Press World Ranking (Freedom House) interestingly just ahead of Iraq at 158.

I react when important information that might be uncomfortable or negative for SG gets covered up, undermined or denied (eg:  The UBS report on Global Income & Expenditure was probably the most damning statement of Singapore "Success", yet the tiny mention it got 3 weeks later was a bunch a local academics/politicians doing their best to discredit and deny it's sad truths).  

BMs I hope that you have the confidence and integrity to let valid, legitimate and proper conversations continue, rather than just deleting them when things get just slightly uncomfortable.