Is 5500 SGD per month good enough for me?

[altoids]

I had the same query from a friend, not knowing how to best put it I created an excel that calculates income required for three different scenarios

Scenario 1: Senior Executive
Scenario 2: Middle Management
Scenario 3: Senior Management

Please go through the google spreadsheet, save it as an excel and change assumptions as you wish, to me  $5500 a month simply doesn't cut it. Yes, it can be livable dependent on lifestyle, but with minimal savings, if it's a stepping stone to a higher position or a different country with better income prospects go for it.

https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AmtYyUHF2TpMdC1uX19KcDBLeWh1VFJtQ2hCSTBsVlE&hl=en&authkey=COfVuvQE


Assumptions: Resident status is EP, single Income family with 2 kids, impact of variables such as incentives or bonus is not included, tax rebates are also not included, actual taxes will be lower.

Edit: Do check with your prospective employer on incentives, if you get a 13th month bonus (a standard practice in Singapore) and a variable bonus of 2 months then your annual goes up to 82500, thats 6875/month effectively which is a decent amount, but certainly not upper middle class

[to 5k]

Re: Is 5500 SGD per month  good enough for me?
if you say it is not, then it isn't. No one can dispute that, since we aren't in your shoes, and can't see what you see. Some people can feed a family of 8 on 2k a month. Some people need 10k a month just for themselves. Who's to judge? If you think you cannot make it, then leave. It's simple.

i make $5k a month, before CPF deduction
own a 1.6l car (bought 2 years ago and still paying for it), which i drive to work every single day.
the traffic back home from work on most evenings drives me mad. But hey, that's just a part of life in a city. You don't want traffic? move to perth or some remote area in the US.
i am living in a nicely renovated resale 5-room HDB flat with my wife, and i am paying the bulk of the mortgage.
we eat out (restaurant, not hawker) once a week - i pay.
go partying/drinking 3-4 times a month - if wife comes along, i pay for her share too.
go for nearby island trips twice a year , and somewhere further for holidays once a year (taiwan, tokyo, korea) - i pay the bulk.
i shop once a month for a new shirt or 2.

we don't have a maid, can't afford one, but we don't need to have one anyways.
no kids and seldom at home except on weekends.
both me and my wife give our parents monthly pocket money and have filial obligations to fulfill like bringing them on short trips yearly, bringing them out to restaurants for nice meals every now then, and so on.

we obviously own a few insurance policies , like many Singaporeans do, which we are paying for every month/ annually. plan to have kids in the next 2 years, so saving up for that too.
and yes, we manage to save cash every month.

sure, i have friends who splurge on books every week, shopping every other day, expensive designer bags costing $2k above. They still live with their parents, many of them do not have their own cars (driving their dad's) and aren't married. It's simply a choice of lifestyle.

so many of you here are painting such a sad, poor, pathetic picture with your 5500 a mth. I do not think i am "scrimping by" every month. maybe i am delusional.

There's a few differences between the OPs situation and yours. OP will have to rent in a LL's dream market. You already own a home so you just need to pay the monthly mortgage payments which would be mostly from your CPF. You haven't mentioned it, but I assume your wife is also working and contributing her share to the family kitty. OP says his wife will most likely be looking after the kids. And most importantly OP has 3 kids, while you have none yet. This one single fact alone would make the OPs cost of living a whole lot expensive than yours.

[Here]

There is no way a foreigner can live in Singapore on the same amount of money as a Singaporean. For some bizarre reason, Singaporeans simply cannot understand this.

Foreigners can only rent/buy property on the open market. Foreigners pay substantially more for schooling, even in government schools (which is around $300 a month now). Foreigners pay more for their maid levy. Foreigners pay more at hospitals (government hospitals and private hospitals cost the same because of this).

[Here]

To 5k: your wife is obviously working. It is completely stupid to even suggest that your situation is anything like the OP's situation.

But your post raises another question: how come Singaporeans don't have joint accounts with their spouses? I'd go pretty nuts if my partner continuously made out he was paying for things with "his" money like you've done here.

[Indian_in_Singapore]

Stupid, Don't claim yourself as "Higher Middle Class". Higher Middle class is supposed to do Business in India not a Job.
Anyway, i come to the point. If your package is about rs. 15 LPA, working in any metro then it's better to continue your job.
If you have typical package like 7--8 LPA, you can think to join.

[Me too]

To above pp:
Don't assume all business people earn bucket loads. Not every business man is an Ambani or a Birla. There are millions of businesses in India which earn less than Rs 15 LPA for their owners.The neighbourhood paan-waala is also running a business.
There are tons of salary earners earning more than 50LPA also in India. Don't know how long you have been in singapore but corporate India has changed long time back and pay is not a concern for major corporations looking out for the best talent.

[titan]

I came to Singapore at age 25 earning 5K a month in 2005. The money was more than enough for a bachelor sharing a 5 room HDB apt with 2 other bachelor friends whom I knew from India. I always had enough to go out for parties at CQ, trips with friends, the odd date now and then(unfortunately few and far between) and yet save 2.5 k a month. Of course rent and cost of living were low.
Difference between my life in India and Singapore, were that I had more money to spend, but in India at 25% of the salary I could afford to get someone to cook for me, someone else to clean the house and do the laundry and a third person to wash my car once a week.

Fast forward to 2011, I make just under 6.2k. I'm married and my wife is unemployed. I am still renting an HDB, but the smallest possible configuration.

Taking a PR was the biggest mistake. Company reduced my salary by the amount they need to contribute. On top of that employee contribution from my salary.

Now I barely save 1K a month, that too by penny pinching to an extraordinary degree. Barely going out. Travel only by bus/MRT. No cabs for personal purposes. Eating out means at the food court. Only 1 trip a year and that too back home to visit our parents.

My college friends in India (in the IT industry) earn roughly around 3.5k to 4k in SGD terms. They live in posh apartments which they own(still have to pay the mortgage). Have servants, can afford to take vacations to places like Phuket, Bali, Egypt, Dubai and are basically enjoying life.
So my new year resolution is to leave Singapore by the middle of this year and try to get a job in India to chase the Indian dream. My singapore dream has turned sour in the last 3 years.

So the point was.... 5.5 K is not enough for an Indian family living an upper middle class life in India. 3K SGD will go a long way in India. Its only just above penury in singapore.

I suppose I should count my blessings on this lack of PR then.

[IndiaChina]

India and China are not yet real economnies, their GDP statistics are dubious at most.

They are perceived as emerging, but in reality , a lot different.

China’s GDP Statistics Questioned U.S.$205 billion discrepancy shows up in calculations

 theepochtimes /n2/content/view/20725/

After the Gross Domestic Product (GDP) reports for the first half of 2009 from various local areas in China were published, the sum was found to exceed China’s national GDP statistic by 1.4 trillion yuan (approximately U.S.$205 billion). Some economists commented that China’s GDP figure could only be used as a “reference.”

In mid-July, the Chinese National Bureau of Statistics announced China’s GDP for the first half of 2009 to be 13.98 trillion yuan (approximately US$2.045 trillion). Meanwhile, the Hong Kong Apple Daily reported the sum of the GDP figures for the first half of the year from 31 provinces and autonomous regions reached 15.38 trillion yuan (approximately U.S.$2.25 trillion). This 1.4 trillion yuan difference is a 10 per cent inflation of the national data.

The Apple Daily’s editorial article entitled, “Who Made the 1.4 Trillion-Yuan Mistake?” commented that the Chinese central government-ordered mandate to “ensure economic growth” under the economic crisis has led to adulteration of the data in local areas to ensure their performance will look good.

The report summarized the main causes of the problem: the over-emphasis of the GDP growth rate in the assessment and the lack of an effective monitoring mechanism. Therefore, the central government is responsible for the false data.

Hu Xingdou, economist and professor at the Beijing Institute of Technology, indicated in an interview with Voice of America that local officials are very likely to produce false and concealed data to achieve so-called “performance.”

He said, “There is no penalty for reporting false information under the current system. The policy of pursuing GDP growth at all costs is bound to encourage local officials at all levels to produce false GDP figures.”

Zhong Dajun, the founder of the Beijing Dajun Economic Observer Center said, “It is clear that the GDP alone does not correspond to the well-being of China’s economy. Investment in useless construction might pull up the GDP figure, but does not improve the livelihood of the public. In this case, no one cares about the GDP.”

The Apple Daily editorial also commented that the central government’s fear that the real data might upset the stock market and thus, social stability has also caused officials to turn a blind eye to the false data put out by the local areas.

Zhong agreed to this theory, “because stock stability does rely on the GDP.”

However, he added, “The number is only a reference for the economist.” He suggested that the Chinese as well as the international community not over emphasize the GDP figure.

Zhong Dajun said, “Economists don’t judge the economy merely based on numbers. The Chinese economists are getting used to this (false data). No one will take it seriously as something concrete. It’s only a reference.”

[An indian perspective]

I came to Singapore at age 25 earning 5K a month in 2005. The money was more than enough for a bachelor sharing a 5 room HDB apt with 2 other bachelor friends whom I knew from India. I always had enough to go out for parties at CQ, trips with friends, the odd date now and then(unfortunately few and far between) and yet save 2.5 k a month. Of course rent and cost of living were low.
Difference between my life in India and Singapore, were that I had more money to spend, but in India at 25% of the salary I could afford to get someone to cook for me, someone else to clean the house and do the laundry and a third person to wash my car once a week.

Fast forward to 2011, I make just under 6.2k. I'm married and my wife is unemployed. I am still renting an HDB, but the smallest possible configuration.

Taking a PR was the biggest mistake. Company reduced my salary by the amount they need to contribute. On top of that employee contribution from my salary.

Now I barely save 1K a month, that too by penny pinching to an extraordinary degree. Barely going out. Travel only by bus/MRT. No cabs for personal purposes. Eating out means at the food court. Only 1 trip a year and that too back home to visit our parents.

My college friends in India (in the IT industry) earn roughly around 3.5k to 4k in SGD terms. They live in posh apartments which they own(still have to pay the mortgage). Have servants, can afford to take vacations to places like Phuket, Bali, Egypt, Dubai and are basically enjoying life.
So my new year resolution is to leave Singapore by the middle of this year and try to get a job in India to chase the Indian dream. My singapore dream has turned sour in the last 3 years.

So the point was.... 5.5 K is not enough for an Indian family living an upper middle class life in India. 3K SGD will go a long way in India. Its only just above penury in singapore.

Ask and you shall receive, knock and the door shall be opened.....

I've been trying for the past month and finally about a week back, I managed to nail an offer from Bangalore for a salary that would be considered good even in Singapore terms. Gross per month would be close to 5200 per month which is only 15% less than my gross in singapore. Plus getting a sign on bonus and a decent relocation package. Waiting for the official papers to be couriered across to me before I can put in my papers. But hopefully not more than 45 days to wait for the offer letter and my one month notice before I can be flee
from this place.
Only bother is having to pay the termination penalty on my 2 yr starhub contract which has more than 12 months on it still left. And the possibility of my landlord not refunding my deposit for not finishing the last 2 months on my lease. Not canceling my PR at the moment so I can't just vamoose without paying the starhub penalty. Hopefully they may be willing to negotiate on the amount.
There are a few challenges. I haven't lived in India for more than a 3 week stretch in the past 6 years, so it will take some getting used to. Also rents and cost of living would have increased from what it was before I came to Singapore. And the 33% tax 
Still I'm really looking forward to be able to afford a better standard of living than what I have been experiencing for the last 3 years.

[working_mom]

I am an Indian and here is my prespective:

Pros:
Most upper middle class Indians own landed properties in India (either acquired or inherited) if not a decently large apartment. The OP with the kind of salary that he will draw will have to make do with a rented HDB apartment (probably 2 BR only). 

You will have access to a huge pool of cheap labour. From fixing your toilet to your pant zip....anything and everything can be fixed. I remember I refitted my entire pregnancy wardrobe for post pregnancy at a fraction of the cost. And then the hired help...you can have a person to clean your house, cook, do gardening and drive you. The best thing is you dont have to hire them. You call an agency and they send over people. If you cannot hire a cook no problem...there are homemakers in every street who cater home cooked food. The home business oppurtunities in India is limitless. You will live with your families or close to them which means children grow up in a loving environment (which unfortunately is lacking in Singapore). The children grow up to be street smart because of the sheer size of each classrooms and not to mention hordes of relatives and neighbours bragging about their kids getting straight As. This prepares the kid for the real world especially when they hit middle school and high school.

Cons:

Lack of security, pollution, red tape and the famed Indian traffic jams to name a few. The reason for this is because the infrastructure is not growing as fast as the economy. Indians are rich but Indian Government is poor. Indian politics is a gutter where an honest man can never survive and this is the only reason why scores of Indians leave India. When you have a government doling out free television sets by cutting the expenditure for education and healthcare you know the system is screwed up. The glorification of mediocrity by Indian politicians has ensured that the best of the brains will go to places where they have the freedom to nurture their talents. The situation in India is best described in Fountainhead and Atlas Shrugged by Ayn Rand.

So coming back to the OP’s question, if you want to leave India for the same reasons that I left  (stated above) Singapore or US are good choices (for any amount of penury pay) but if you are not really bothered about the cons I stated then stick to India....

[RP]

Hi OP,

I agree that 5500 is a low income when you think of coming to Singapore on an EP. Also do not come on the hopes that your wife will get a decent enaugh job on a DP the only way your wife can come to Singapore. As many have opined its not a upper middle class income in Singapore, yes the comfort factors are available but not worth the risk with such an income.

All the best to make the right informed decesion.