Singapore on $20k Sing a month

[Need Help]

Is $20k Sing a month (all in) enough for a family of 4 (two young girls aged 3 and 5.) We'd like a house and a reasonable lifestyle (probably need a car too....) and despite going through various threads (including the excellent JohnSin thread) I can't make up my mind.....

Honest opinions please - is $20k Sing too low to live a decent life in Singapore?

[Johnson11]

Is the 20k/mth after taxes?  Where are you located now?
Are you planning to send your kids to international schools?
Have you looked at local schools?

[Approx]

20k a month

tax - 3k
Housing - 7k (of course you can go lower and much higher)
int. school x 2 (as young say 5k/kid/term) = 2.5k
car - 1.5k
utiils - 0.4k

so that leaves about 5k to do everything else

[Need Help]

Thanks a lot for the inital replies, $20k Sing is gross and not minus any tax/costs. Yes, I'd like to send the kids to international schools/nurseries (ages 3 and 5 so I'm told they won't go to school "properly" until 7 in Singapore - is this correct?)

I'd budgeted for 4/5k for a house is that ridiculous?

"Approx" - $5k Sing doesn't sound like much for a family of 4. It sounds like even less in Singapore. Thanks again...

Johnners - we're currently in Dubai. Have assumed local schools are out, at least for the first year or so?

[David A. Simpson]

Dear Need Help,

Are you originally from India? If so, you will find the instruction method in local schools similar to schools back home but much better. With international schools, there are only a small number of acceptable quality. I was shocked when I queried for lists of universities of recent graduates. Given the highly advantaged demographics of expats, there is no reason why so many international school graduates go on to third rate universities. For these, it's as if you are paying them to make your kids stupid. This is the reason why some schools have long waiting lists (years). It is not uncommon for international schools here to be for-profit enterprises. Avoid those at all cost. If not for the social implications, it is usually better to have your spouse home-school your children.

20K/month may sound like a decent amount and you will have the trolls telling you about locals living luxuriously on 3K/month (this only applies to adult children living at home with wealthy parents). However, it is particularly expensive here when you're a non-Asian expat. It is absurd to suggest that you should get off your "high horse" and live like a local. The US has millions of immigrants, claiming to want to become Americans, yet cling to their old ways of living. No one (other than Republicans) expects them to give up their egg foo young and tandoori chicken for hot dogs and grits so it is ridiculous to expect a professional expat to have their family meals at the hawker center eating char quay tow and roti prata a when their normal diet consists of whole grain breads, quality red meat, cheese, wine, mesclun, etc. However, anything here associated with expats typically costs several fold (and more) what you pay at home so you can do the math. The sad truth is that S$20k/month here gives you a worse life than half that amount back home. (much, much worse if you are from China or India).

[HousingOk]

You can get housing for 5k but the bathrooms might not be very nice. You won't get a house like you had at home. That said the housing situation here is one of the weak points of Singapore that you trade off to be here.  For that income you will probably pay closer to 2k tax.
Rather than have a house it might be nicer to stay in a smaller condo near an mrt, then you won't need a car and will have a nice pool for the kids to enjoy and friends to play with in the condo

[Agent007]

Simpson, what planet are you from you stupid time wasting twat?

I can just imagine you asking your wife for mesclun! Nancy boy. Prick.

You know nothing about education. Nothing about food and probably nothing about anything at all.

20k is more than sufficient to have a good standard of living in Singapore. You will be earning more than 98% of all people here. Ignore idiots like Bart Effing Simpson.

[Agree W Simpson]

More lies and disinformation from the agent moron.

OP, as a Westerner, you will struggle to get by (and fail) on that amount for a couple with two kids. This place is super expensive. International schools and rent are stratospheric. Everything costs a bomb. Going back home to see your folks will be a luxury you will not be able to afford. Does your employer offer any allowances? Health Insurance or transport?

[another view]

I am always astounded when people write that you can't live here in 20k a month.  We have been living on a combined salary of about 18k for the last 6 years - with three children at international school (paying our own fees).  We run a small car, a Honda Jazz which we bought 4 years ago, and take the entire family back to the UK every summer, as well as one holiday in the region each year.  Since we are PR we are saving our CPF, plus we have an income on the rental of our house in the UK, which we save.  We're not rich, but we weren't rich in the UK either and we have the luxury of  a live in maid, condo facilities etc here.  We don't drink much - only if we have friends over, and don't eat out in expensive restaurants.  I shop in NTUC, the children do lots of activities but I'm careful not to get sucked into expat kids activities that cost a small fortune.  e.g they do ANZA soccer, not ISA.  We have a four bedroom apartment costing just under $4k a month.  Life is sweet!

I suppose what it boils down to is, would you have a better standard of living by staying where you are or not?  We have a better life here

[Need help]

Hi David Simpson - thank you for your informative post, I appreciate it. I have no idea why you suspected I was from India/China as I'm British and have an English Literature degree!

Agent007 - wind your mammaries in a tad pal.

As to the other questions, one return flight per annum and healthcare/insurance would be the only additions to the $20k Sing. There is a decent (discretionary) bonus structure but I prefer to focus on my guaranteed income as opposed to those additions which are beyond my control. I think I'm getting the picture that $20k per month is simply not enough to make this move viable.....

[Need Help]

Thanks "Another View." Maybe that's the problem, we have a very good lifestyle here and have become used to living well. The question would be how quickly we could adjust and make concessions....easy to say but harder to do. We've never been great at budgeting properly.

[There's The Rub]

Yes, why live on the bones of one's proverbial, counting every penny and cutting every corner, if one doesn't have to? Life is simply too short for that.

Alcohol is very expensive here, as is eating out in nice restaurants, or even cooking good quality food at home. Cars cost the Earth too, so a lot of people buy 2nd hand, but it is still very, very silly money for what you are getting.

[There's The Rub]

I suggest you make a trip over here and look at the type of housing, etc that you would like to live in vs what your budget will allow, etc, as well as the next few levels below that, to be sure. With the benefit of many years experience here, for us, 20k is not enough.

[Not worth it]

Thanks "Another View." Maybe that's the problem, we have a very good lifestyle here and have become used to living well. The question would be how quickly we could adjust and make concessions....easy to say but harder to do. We've never been great at budgeting properly.

You will need to earn at least 100k a month if you want to maintain your "very good lifetsyle" This is what the average expat earns here. With 20k, your life is going to be real miserable . So please do not come.

[Salary Levels]

A spot of research online should reveal salary surveys for Singapore by various headhunters. There are some headhunters that provide different surveys by industry. There are a range of figures for base remuneration at different levels of seniority, etc.